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Wash. state lawmakers debating assault weapons ban

by MEG COYLE / KING 5 News

KING5.com

Posted on January 26, 2010 at 8:12 AM

Updated Tuesday, Jan 26 at 12:33 PM

OLYMPIA, Wash –State legislators heard arguments Tuesday for and against a ban on assault weapons.

The Senate Judiciary Committee is considering a bill that would ban military-style assault weapons that can fire rapidly and carry a lot of ammunition. It's sponsored by Sen. Adam Kline of Seattle and faces stiff opposition in an election year.

Supporters, including Washington Ceasefire and other gun control groups, cite the recent deaths of police officers, as well as 18-year-old Aaaron Sullivan in Seattle's Leschi neighborhood last summer, as evidence that something needs to be done.

"It is an insult to victims like Aaron Sullivan and (Seattle Police Officer) Timothy Brenton to split hair over semantics over what is and what isn't a semi-automatic assault weapon," Ralph Fascitelli of Washington Ceasefire told the committee. "If it holds more than 10 bullets, in my mind, it is. If it automatically loads and discharges bullets, it is. And if its original design, intent was to kill many humans and not animals, it is."

Opponents, including the National Rifle Association, say gun crimes aren't about the weapons that were used, but the people using them.

"This bill will so confuse and not control. Other states and federal law have resulted in three outcomes: ramapant confusion, unjust prosecution and increased sales. Everybody loses with this bill," said NRA lobbyist Brian Judy.

Similar bans haven't fared well in the past and, in an election year, supporters face a battle to even get the bill out of committee.   

Gov. Chris Gregoire says she hasn't reviewed the proposed ban. Instead, she says she is focusing on a group of bills in response to the recent police shootings, including better communication between law enforcement on jail bookings and releases.
 

 

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Comments: Displaying 1 - 15 of 52

hunger4blood4256 said on January 27, 2010 at 10:15 PM

yeah, I think a criminal would rather pick up that illegal fully automatic ak-47 for 100 bucks (or 200 depending on the dealer....cough...not that I actually know...this is purely hypothetical) than to buy the semi automatic one for 399-799 sometimes more depending on what manufacturer makes it.

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washingtonskier said on January 27, 2010 at 4:42 PM

oh and my "assault rifle" which is a ar-15 cost $2,000 and my cheap one was $800..... yeah the criminal is going to find an illegal way because most wouldn't pay that much

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jcwing123 said on January 27, 2010 at 12:03 PM

Yes, its the guns that kill, not the people. THe guns control the people, not the other way around. Man, I am sure glad that these anti-gun groups straightened me out on that. I guess I better restrain my guns so they just don't go out of control and start raising havoc.

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scott04 said on January 26, 2010 at 10:45 PM

the right to bare arms is older than the constitution

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kingsolver1000rr said on January 26, 2010 at 9:31 PM

none of the recent shootings have been from assult weapons- frikin idiots- do you cease fire morons understand how hard and obvious it is to carry and conceal an assult riffle? Go to the gun store some time and touch one so that you know what you are talking about. If some one is running around with a assult rifle you are going to know it. Handguns on the other hand, can be concealed very easily, and allow a person of bad intent to get very close to their target before letting their intentions be known. The current RCWs should be as they are.

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tomma206 said on January 26, 2010 at 6:51 PM

During the last "assault" rifle ban, all the gun makers did was alter a few things to make it not fit their description of assault rifle and they were sold all the same.The people crying for new gun restrictions have misled themselves into thinking new laws will help.Guns will be around forever.

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masterblaster said on January 26, 2010 at 6:32 PM

vote no

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stevenhank3666 said on January 26, 2010 at 5:24 PM

Assault weapons ban I think that this will have little affect on the Police shootings. They where killed with hand guns. Not Assault weapons. I also thing the law makers should know what there talking about like what is an Assault weapons. This might be good for them to know.

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dacaptain said on January 26, 2010 at 4:54 PM

I went to a friends house the other day. He owns an AR-15 or something like that. He competes at target shoots all over the northwest and is a range officer at the local shooting range. That rifle sat there all afternoon and didn't do anything. It didn't attempt to aim at us or even shoot by itself. Hmmmm, maybe there has to be another factor involved. Will continue to investigate the issue.

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jonjuan said on January 26, 2010 at 3:42 PM

We have a budget to fix get on it now!

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washingtonskier said on January 26, 2010 at 3:42 PM

ok i may not need an assault rifle well i do because i compete at a national level with one!!! it is a semi-automatic m-16 aka an ar-15 they want to ban what i have spent my life competing with yeah and PS at camp perry where nationals are held during assault rifle week there was no crime nobody got hurt except 2 people tripped there were 6000 people there

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getafterit said on January 26, 2010 at 3:39 PM

@copperheadcsa, Well said! You could also add what is going on in Mexico. Guns are actually illegal in Mexico, so citizens have no way to protect themselves for the drug cartels that are killing innocent people. All these liberals who think guns are the problem should take a trip down south!!

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washingtonskier said on January 26, 2010 at 3:37 PM

the second protects the first and the first protect the second and the second protects the rest

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copperheadcsa said on January 26, 2010 at 3:15 PM

The only I have left to add is one more from Thomas Jefferson: ""The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is it's natural manure."

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h8red42 said on January 26, 2010 at 3:10 PM

I do not own fire arms,but I'm with the NRA on this one.The 2 amendment had nothing to do with hunting,it had to do with arming the citizenry against an over reaching government.besides criminals don't care if something is illegal that is why they are criminals.

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sumner_son said on January 26, 2010 at 3:05 PM

2nd Amendment? 4th Amendment? WA State Constitution? Apparently Sen. Kline has either not read these "insignificant" documents, or he forgot that he is actually supposed to uphold them.

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appledumpling said on January 26, 2010 at 2:57 PM

I understand cjcampbell to be correct in that the legislation is written to redefine how "assault weapons" are defined. The news story is misleading and wants people to think this legislation would outlaw guns that "fire rapidly and carry a lot of ammunition". This is a trick! This will be the propaganda used to get dumb people to support this legislation. The guns impacted are commonly owned firearms used for hunting. The other issue that needs to be addressed by true Americans concerned with freedom and attrition of our constitutional rights is that this type of legislation and other anti-American/Gun lobby is that the common man's ability to purchase and legally own a firearm are slowly being compromised. There will come a time when excessive regulation, taxation and controls on ammunition, loading supplies, etc will be so costly that your constitutional right to "obtain" arms will be lost. That's the agenda currently in play...along with BS like this legislation. Call reps!

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livinglife said on January 26, 2010 at 2:53 PM

Jackwrong- just because of this ban will not stop people from killing others. The weapon of choice is not to blame. its the person controlling it. Guns dont kill people, people kill people. They shouldn't be banning guns...how hard is it for people to see this...The ones who miss use the weapons are criminals. They obviously dont care about the law, therefor they will still have them ILLEGALLY anyways and now the civilians can not defend themselves. Also an annual inspection will not stop the criminals from miss using the weapons either. I fully agree with hunger4blood4256

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saneinseattle said on January 26, 2010 at 2:49 PM

To musicfreak: Using your logic why does anyone need the right to free speech? Or, the freedom of religion? It is about personal liberty to pursue what makes you happy. Besides, if you look at the FBI statistics you will see that a very small percentage of all crime involve firearms of the assault weapon flavor and the last time I check murder and assault were already illegal. And if you really stop to think about it there is only one amendment that guarantees the others will not be taken away. --- ---"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." ~Benjamin Franklin - 1775

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copperheadcsa said on January 26, 2010 at 2:46 PM

This is idiocy of the highest order. Sorry folks but the 2nd Amendment specifically protects just these types of weapons. As uncomfortable as it may make some people, the 2nd Amendment is not about hunting or target shooting. It's about taking up arms against your government when it has become a tyranny. Over the past century and ½ there have been 7 major instances of genocide in this world. You know, Pol Pot, Hilter, Stalin and the rest of history's greatest murderers. The one commonality in every case is the disarming of the target population prior their extermination. You wouldn’t want your victims to shoot back now would you? “For a people who are free, and who mean to remain so, a well-organized and armed militia is their best security.” –Thomas Jefferson

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nwspeedthree said on January 26, 2010 at 2:45 PM

Spot on hunger4blood4256

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hunger4blood4256 said on January 26, 2010 at 2:30 PM

Jackwong, you know how easy it is to obtain an illegal firearm? I know a few people that I could have obtained some really nice guns from that were either altered or illegal all together. Though I chose to not buy those, why? I'm not a criminal and I purchase my firearms through legal means, even though I end up paying more. Also, if you read the bill sb-6396. It states that if you are in ownership of a current gun that fall under this bill, you can keep them. BUT!!!! you have to agree to a annual inspection by law enforcement. (Also violating the 4th amendment). Now to musicfreak, to your question of why would any civi need an assault weapon. It's a hobby for most, they like to go target shooting, etc. I could ask why anyone would need a hummer? a standard car would get them to there destination just as easy. It can also be used as a home defense weapon as most of those weapons are extremely accurate and there will be less collateral damage.

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cjcampbell said on January 26, 2010 at 2:11 PM

jackwong, if the Washington legislature really wanted to ban guns, they would amend the state's constitution so that it would allow them to do it. Right now, all they are doing is pretending to "do something" about the problem you imagine. They know full well that Washington's constitution is even more protective of gun rights than the Federal Constitution. They know that their law will be found unconstitutional in the state of Washington and that this whole exercise is just a waste of time and money so that they can pretend to be "doing something."

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trojan33 said on January 26, 2010 at 1:53 PM

I always hear how intelligent these anti-gun intellectuals are. However, it seems that they are some of the most ignorant people around. It's as if they don't read any history or data on the subject and lack even the most basic knowledge of weapons of any sort. Maybe they are just choosing to ignore the facts and common sense. Whatever the case is, it is clear they should not have anything to do with lawmaking.

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lmiller658 said on January 26, 2010 at 1:43 PM

What we need is a ban on politicians who want to make more laws, instead of Enforcing the laws we already have. Ban Judges who turn Felons free. Ban the Legal system that gives hand slaps to the scum in our society. Put some weight behind a criminal charge. Lock up the bad guys, and leave citizen Joe alone.

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jackwong said on January 26, 2010 at 1:42 PM

So glad our gov't is doing something about it, because the federal gov't sure isnt. So we may have no more officers killed.

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cjcampbell said on January 26, 2010 at 1:41 PM

Musicfreak, real assault weapons are already illegal. What this legislation is redefine assault weapons to include ordinary shotguns, hunting rifles, and handguns.

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refred said on January 26, 2010 at 1:37 PM

So, if we are going to take away assault weapons because a few people abuse them, let's outlaw cars, alcohol, cell phones, knives, prescription pain killers, etc. Why make those of us who are responsible gun owners for what criminals will do even if outlawed? Instead, let's toughen the laws when criminals are found in posession of weapons (automatic prison time, etc.) and get these lawmakers doing something useful for a change.

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logic14 said on January 26, 2010 at 1:36 PM

Gov. Chris Gregoire needs to give negative comments about the liberal insane supreme court justices in this state. The justices are the ones putting citizens at risk with their crazy case law. These idiots are making Washington the ideal state to be a criminal. If the public was slightly aware of the restrictions that these guys put on law enforcement they would be furious. Communication is great but these judges have handcuffed law enforcement.

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musicfreak said on January 26, 2010 at 1:35 PM

Okay, while I understand that it won't stop the criminals from getting them, why on earth does ANY CIVILIAN need an assault weapon? It's certainly not for game hunting. I'm all for people owning a handgun or a shotgun or a rifle for protection. A shotgun or a rifle for hunting. But I cannot find any fathomable reason why a civilian needs an assault weapon, and yet everyone cries foul when they want to make assault weapons illegal to own.

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clear2copy said on January 26, 2010 at 1:31 PM

ghmariner King5 has ALWAYS been anti-gun.. sensational fear over reason and facts

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ghmariner said on January 26, 2010 at 1:02 PM

The still frame at the top of the roll ia a "Hand Gun," it's not an assault weapon! Come on King 5 do your homework! Know the difference.

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yours_truly said on January 26, 2010 at 12:30 PM

This gun ban will do nothing to stop crime. Any politician from my district that votes for it will not receive my vote come election. And giving the sheriff the explicit right to search and seizure violates our civil rights.

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mtrgphr said on January 26, 2010 at 12:02 PM

When guns are banned only the criminals will have the guns. What does that realy say. It is illegal for criminals to possess firearms but is that law enforced, They sure seem to have weapons when needed or wanted. Start hammering the criminal and stop harrassing the honest citizen.

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graham said on January 26, 2010 at 11:49 AM

They also need to ban the nuts from the NRA

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milleramerican85 said on January 26, 2010 at 11:31 AM

FIGHT CRIME, SHOOT BACK!!! This will never stand as federal law and our constitutional laws uphold our rights to bare fire arms. The ban is a joke in Seattle and Snohomish County and this bill would be too. Others have already stated that the criminals do not care about the law anyway so this in effect will do no good to stop the rash of violence we have seen in these parts lately. Only informed, well trained gun holding citizens can stop the violence through the fear of the criminals being afraid of being shot dead themselves. What a joke when we can't keep the state finacially afloat!

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saneinseattle said on January 26, 2010 at 11:20 AM

I wish the anti-gun community would stop and look at the validity of their argument. Here is a simple test for their logic everywhere they use the words: gun, firearm or assault weapon replace it with automobile. Here are some examples: Ban cars that go over 5 miles per hour so criminals can’t out run the police. Ban automobiles with spoilers or look aerodynamic because if it looks fast it is too dangerous for the average person to own. Limit automobiles to 1 gallon of gas so, it doesn’t have more capacity than a police cruiser. And, here is my personal favorite, ban all automobiles that move because a drunk driver might get behind the wheel and kill someone. Do any of these may sense to anyone with half a brain? I think not.

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livinglife said on January 26, 2010 at 11:06 AM

I support the NRA !

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reh12 said on January 26, 2010 at 10:48 AM

here we go again. it never ends. i wonder if we will re-elect all these clowns ? oh well, washington citizens did elect them. aren't we the smart ones? will we ever learn?

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chuckstr76 said on January 26, 2010 at 10:21 AM

If guns are outlawed, then only the outlaws will have guns.

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think said on January 26, 2010 at 10:09 AM

Honestly, I read a lot about crime everyday. I fail to see the link between crime, and 'assault weapons'. The recent murders of five Lakewood officers and a Pierce County Sheriff's deputy were effected without assualt weapons. The legislature of this State, and all States for that matter, really need to focus on more pressing issues that truly affect our everyday standard-of-living. It looks like they want to waste their time, and tax-payer resources, once again!

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averagejoe said on January 26, 2010 at 10:07 AM

Here we go again! we have had some unfortunate incidents here in washington lately, and the Anti-Gun Lobby is jumping on their band wagon to get more laws passed regarding assualt weapons. When will these people realize that placing more restrictive laws on firearms is only going to penalize your law abiding citizens, who follow the rules and regulations when purchasing their firearms? the PEOPLE who use a firearm in the commission of a crime very rarely purchase the weapon through legal means. they are purchased from someone who usually got them through some illegal means, and is selling them illegally (no background checks, paperwork, etc.). the answer to this dilemma is to enforce the rules we already have in place, against the PEOPLE who commit the crimes. A firearm is an inanimate object that can perform no violent act without a PERSON taking control of and utilizing the Firearm as a tool to perform his/her will. Read the 2nd amendment. it is easy to understand.

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clear2copy said on January 26, 2010 at 9:50 AM

I wish they'd stop with this over-emotional fluff legislation. Focus on making a real difference and toughen laws regarding DUI drivers. Stop wasting our time and money.

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kathieb said on January 26, 2010 at 9:44 AM

Again, another bill that will only hurt law abiding citizens! Why do they think that passing a bill will stop the criminals? Do you actually think the criminals will say, "Oh, oh, there's a bill against this so I'd better get rid of this gun?" As usual, stupidity!!!! Again, only the criminals will be armed! Why aren't they working on the important issues that has this state in such dire straits? Get a clue in Olympia, please. Write to your representatives and tell them to get on with business and leave these rediculous laws alone!

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clothyard said on January 26, 2010 at 9:37 AM

Another red herring from the anti 2nd amendment crowd. The four police officers in Lakewood were NOT killed with an assault rifle, or a rifle, or a shotgun. They were NOT killed with a legally obtained weapons. Clemmons was a felon and was prohibited from owning guns of any kind, but that law didnt stop him and a new law wont stop criminals from getting whichever weapon they want. Montfort's weapon was NOT legally obtained. The Drunk who shot Deputy Mundell did NOT have an assault weapon. Criminals do not care about the law, and law abiding citizens dont run around shooting poilce officers. Simply another attempt to add another useless law to be ignored by criminals.

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cjcampbell said on January 26, 2010 at 9:29 AM

Washington State's Constitution governs here: "SECTION 24 RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS. The right of the individual citizen to bear arms in defense of himself, or the state, shall not be impaired, but nothing in this section shall be construed as authorizing individuals or corporations to organize, maintain or employ an armed body of men." If politicians really believe they are right, they would have the moral backbone to change the constitution and stop trying to re-write the dictionary for political purposes. If you want to ban guns, fine, but be up-front about it.

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junior123 said on January 26, 2010 at 9:26 AM

Did the supreme court rule 2 years ago in wash DC that it is unconstitutioal to ban hand guns in any state?? this would mean they are wasting thier time and our money trying to make unconstitutional laws.

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__m96__ said on January 26, 2010 at 9:24 AM

adam kline........check

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cjcampbell said on January 26, 2010 at 9:13 AM

The gun in the photo is not an assault weapon. It is a semi-automatic pistol of a type in use since before World War I. One would think that NWCN would have a file photo of an assault weapon somewhere. An assault weapon is traditionally a short-barrelled rifle capable of both single fire and fully automatic fire, having a cartridge heavier than a pistol but lighter than a battle rifle. The ammunition is contained in a detachable magazine. Looking like an assault rifle does not make it an assault rifle. For example, the Colt AR-15 hunting rifle looks like the M-16 assault rifle but it does not have the capability of automatic fire. It is no more an assault rifle than a kiddie Corvette is a real Corvette. The term "assault rifle" was invented by Adolf Hitler to describe the Sturmgewehr 44. Sturmgewehr means, literally, storm rifle or assault rifle. It is already illegal for most citizens to own an assault weapon, so this bill is just more political grandstanding.

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jamey said on January 26, 2010 at 9:11 AM

I guess this should jsut be a given every year for Washington Cease Fire. Every year WCF trys to leverage someone's death to advance their agenda of taking guns out of the hands of law abiding citizens. And every year they fail because most people are smart enough to realize that if guns are taken away from the good people, only the criminals will have them. And as you have heard before, guns don't kill people, people kill people. We have laws against felons having guns, we just need to enforce them. The courts need to quit letting violent offenders off easy and the DOC needs to quit letting them out of jail early. The bleeding hearts trying to take your gun rights are the same bleeding hearts letting criminals out of jail. Seems like listening to them is just "shooting ourselves in the foot".

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sirbobby98121312 said on January 26, 2010 at 9:05 AM

This is a poorly redone Clinton-era weapons ban attempt - an effort to ban 'scary-looking features'...including the dreaded barrel shroud. In the middle of this bill you find "No person in this state shall possess or have under his or her control at one time both of the following: (a) A semiautomatic or pump-action rifle, semiautomatic pistol, or shotgun capable of accepting a detachable magazine; and (b) Any magazine capable of use with that firearm that contains more than ten rounds of ammunition." This effectively encmpasses every weapon ever made, with a few revolver execptions. And - this law in no way affects what a criminal will in no way affect a criminal's behavior. Bad idea. Bad law.

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camanojoe said on January 26, 2010 at 8:57 AM

Why don't these politicians just do something worth while? Like get tough on crime? These are the same idiots that give rights to terrorists after they try to kill as many of us as they can. These same politicians are standing in the way of real security while they come up with new laws that do nothing to protect the citizenry. The people that want to do us harm don't care about the next law that these idiots legislate. How about getting tough on criminals before imposing another law that criminals are going to break anyway. Law abiding citizens don't need another law on the books while you legislators continue to make laws that allow violent criminals the right to vote and to be released back into the community with such ease. Stop making new laws and start enforcing the ones that are on the books. Those of you in Olympia need to remember Massachusetts. Wise up or we'll find someone to replace you.

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