Kent man protests Seattle gun ban at community center

concealedcarrier said on November 19, 2009 at 11:56 PM

It's comical that anti-gunners like world_citizen use the same terms all the time. Saying things like legally acquired guns end up in the hands of criminals. Well lets think about this. At ANY point that a firearm ends up in the hands of a criminal it is no longer a LEGAL firearm. If it is stolen, that is illegal. If it is knowingly sold to a criminal that is illegal. So therefore all these "legal" guns really aren't legal at that point. I would stand tall on my views in front of the Ft. Hood families and the family of the fallen officer. I would also bet money that they would all also be pro gun. I feel it is also safe to say that they are not blinded by ignorance to think that the "guns" killed those people. Both shooters are in custody and will be put on trial, not the guns. Would it make you anti-gun people feel better if these people were murdered with an axe? I have my CPL and carry a gun not because it "makes me feel tough" or because I'm "scared." It's for protection if needed.

sp2009 said on November 16, 2009 at 10:33 AM

OMG your and idiot! Are you actually suggesting that we disarm the military??? You must be, they are all issued legal guns. Also I doubt that a "pieced together gun" used to shoot the Seattle police officer was a legal gun as you keep claiming. I know.... lets ban cars, booze, and prescription pain killers. They are all legal but somehow manage to kill thousands of people every year because they are obtained thru legal means and sometimes used in an illegal manor. They must be bad and we need to ban them! Oh and I would stand firm on my pro-gun platform in front of them without issue. While I sympathize with all of them why would I back down on what I believe? Just like I stand firm on you right to free speech even though I prefer you just shut up!

chuckstr76 said on November 16, 2009 at 10:20 AM

Bob Warden choise to let people know when he was armed, I prefer to keep them guessing. Thanks Bob for bring this to light

world_citizen said on November 16, 2009 at 8:35 AM

Fair enough. We have made our points and we aren't changing each other's way of thinking. I would like, however, to see you stand strong on you pro-gun platform in front of the many Fort Hood families and in front of the recently killed Seattle police officer’s wife and their kids telling them that legally acquired guns are found only in the hands of law abiding citizens. Also if you are so much in favor of the existing laws, then you must be pro-choice also, since it is the Law. Signing off for now.

libretarian said on November 16, 2009 at 6:28 AM

We'll see how the liberals like it when they can no longer mouth off freely because there is no one left to defend that right. That's right, the second holds up the first. Better remember that.

garlicman said on November 16, 2009 at 5:29 AM

The law is clear. Neither municipalities nor counties may have gun regulations that are more restrictive than the state's. Seattle property is not private property; the mayor can't simply say, "No guns." The city will spend hundreds of thousands of dollars to have a judge rule against them. It is no coincidence that the safest states have the most liberal gun laws, and that the states with the most strict gun laws are among the most dangerous.

rpf4567 said on November 16, 2009 at 12:19 AM

lets not forget that our right to bear arms is not just to defend ourselves against criminals, it is also there in cases of invasion or more importantly if the people have to rise up against are federal government. our founding fathers were extremely concerned that we might lose track of our original intent and our government would became power hunger and turn into a feudal society(once again). the second amend is one of our most important rights, the time we live in is a time were politicians have lost sight of public service and citizens have lost sight of public duty. politicians care more about making a scene and being recognized so they can win another term stay in office. so as Americans we have to fight and preserve every single one of our rights or before you know it we will be stripped of everything.

beren said on November 15, 2009 at 10:15 PM

Hey World_citizen, Switzerland has the highest number of guns per capita than anywhere on earth, and their crime is lower than just about anywhere else. For example: in 1993, the number of reported armed robberies in Geneva was exactly zero. What say you to that?

thinker said on November 15, 2009 at 8:37 PM

guns are bad, mmm'kay. so don't carry guns, mmm'kay

thenomadicone said on November 15, 2009 at 2:03 PM

Let me bring a different perspective to this. I am over 50 and twice in my life the mere presence of a hand gun has prevented me from being a victim of violent crime. Did it stop a crime for happening? Probably not, but I'm sure the next target was probably someone like "WorldCitizen".... or at least I hope it was!

mistyday said on November 15, 2009 at 1:48 PM

There is so much fear being voiced in the comments. Fear of guns is real. But guns don't kill, people do. A legal concealed weapon comes with responsibility. Those who take the time to get a concealed weapons permit understand this. For those of you who may not know, there are many times a person may pass you with a legal concealed weapon. Many are required to carry an off duty weapon which you do not see. People who committ crime will committ crime. Some executive orders will not stand up in a court of law. If any of you think this order will stop someone who wants to commit a crime from carrying a gun you are sadly misinformed

dennilane said on November 15, 2009 at 11:52 AM

Wow, world_citizen. Fer reals? Do you ever just step back and read what you write? Do you really think making laws that take legally owned guns out of upstanding, law abiding citizens hands will also keep the guns from the criminals and crazies who actually commint the crimes? Don't you think that if guns are banned, then nobody will have them? The criminals will find a way to have them, just like they do with Heroine, Pot, Crack, etc...? In your world, I'm assuming, it's OK for Police to have guns. OK. Do you think that all policemen are good, upstanding people who don;t shoot people in public in front of children? Really???. http://www.seattlepi.com/local/119458_chief26ww.html Police are just as F'd up and crazy as any other "criminal" can be. You don't think the police dept can be corrupt and possibly sell firearms to ccriminals in order to make $$? Please Mr. world_citizen, get a clue.

realitychk said on November 15, 2009 at 11:27 AM

3 quotes of Benjamin Franklin are appropriate: "Anyone who trades liberty for security deserves neither liberty nor security. " "Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both." "The only thing more expensive than education is ignorance."

blankingout said on November 15, 2009 at 11:21 AM

So, just thinking, earlier articles have a quote from a city blowhard saying they got a team of lawyers ready for people who fight this at the city level. If the attorney general wants to fight this, just motion to move it to the state level and set a precedent. Then everyone can do that and show that p.o.s. Nickels!

zarathustra said on November 15, 2009 at 11:18 AM

When fear is used as rationale to carryout irrational behavior our motives become corrupt with anxiety and intellectual laziness. If society has “truly” fallen so far that citizens must be armed in public in order to feel secure then we must question society and come up with more logical answers to our problems. Subjecting a Band-Aid, such as armed citizens, to such a problem is not only useless and irrational but in the long run can magnify societal problems. If one’s motives are not based on selfishness or fear, rational and intellectual solutions would prevail. Otherwise we are left with the story at hand, decision making based on anxiety, intellectual laziness and selfishness.

cougforester said on November 15, 2009 at 10:46 AM

can't say I have ever heard or seen a criminal go "oops, I am packing" and leave. I have seen criminals come into places like restaurants, movie theaters, community centers and malls and start shooting. I think I will take my chances and keep my CWP and defend myself, my family and the bleeding heart liberals who think law abiding citizens should not have a CWP.

natelw said on November 15, 2009 at 10:31 AM

You are hilarious to think this hasn't happened; you "validate" only your ignorance about the subject. Your quote, "Those who walk into a mall thinking that someone around them are (sic) carrying illegally obtained (but leggaly (sic) made) guns and legally purchase (sic) by someone initially, are people who scare me." My response. Google "mall shooting washington state" and it will return no less that 290,000 hits. Do you need more validation? I am right, you are wrong - deal with it and go speak about a topic on which you have some clue, I'm guessing "How to whine about things you don't understand and try to get your way - a 3 year-olds guide to being a child." BTW - dead industry? Do you mean funeral home industry, because that will never go out of business.

world_citizen said on November 15, 2009 at 10:19 AM

Those who walk into a mall thinking that someone around them are carrying illegally obtained (but leggaly made) guns and legally purchase by someone initially, are people who scare me. The "I don't feel safe" complex is bit scary as some of these law abiding gun owners may think that I or my children are carrying guns into the mall. Mamny of my previous points and concerns have been validated. Thank you!

randolphlsmith said on November 15, 2009 at 10:15 AM

Ever wonder why the word blithering is always connected with idiots?

daunte said on November 15, 2009 at 10:08 AM

You know world_citizen, there is a saying that Abraham Lincoln once said. "Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt."

natelw said on November 15, 2009 at 10:04 AM

World-Citizen, you, just as Seattle's outgoing mayor, are a huge fool. Just as I don't deny you the right of doing things I have never found interesting or have the desire for (i.e. wearing socks w/sandals, driving a subaru, eating tofu, drinking non-fat lattes, yoga, protesting, etc.) you shouldn't deny someone their right. Your mentality is, "If I don't understand it, it should be illegal." If you don't want your children around guns, you better buy an island somewhere, because, just as outlawing narcotics didn't solve, but exacerbated, the problem of drug use, outlawing guns would result in the same situation-CRIMINALS WILL ALWAYS HAVE GUNS and will always find a way to obtain them - you know this is true, but somehow try to suggest that removing guns from everyone altogether will solve the problem. There is absolutely no reasonable answer for this fact! I have 1 summarized quote for you my friend..."Now that we have gun control, we can prosper as a nation!" A. Hitler

world_citizen said on November 15, 2009 at 9:55 AM

Not all Laws are just and right. Many laws have been creating to protect industries and to protect unfair practices. Segretation, banking, insurance and environmentally damaging industries have had the protection of the "WRONG LAWS". Well, gun carrying laws are next to be overturned. The best protection is education, economic opportunity and the elimination of guns from the streets. HOW MANY MORE high schools and college tragedies do we need to prove the point? How many more killings in the homes at the hands of the same people from the house and how many more police officer must die before we change the laws that protect the death industry? I say to you that by supporting the gun industry you may just carry some of the blame. Just as buying drugs supports the killings in Mexico and in the streets of our communities.

world_citizen said on November 15, 2009 at 9:41 AM

Yes natelw, you are so right, and thanks to so many law abiding gun carrying cowards (aka citizens) the death industry continues to grow and grow and millions of these legally made and originally obtained guns find their way into criminal hands. You and your buddies are indeed protecting the industry. Do you know how many crimes are committed with legally obtained guns stolen from idiots who can't protect them but who bought them for protection, fun or the so-called sport practice. The reality is guns kill and many of them are used for that purpose every day. We are still mourning the death of a police officer in Seattle and many in Fort Hood (remember these recent tragedies committed with legally acquired weapons!) Bottom line, “I DON'T WANT MY CHILDREN around guns even if they Law says otherwise. We will overturn the law and support those politicians who agree with us. Wake up!

natelw said on November 15, 2009 at 9:36 AM

World-Citizen, you ignorance is so apparent, a "criminal" cannot obtain a CPL, make your argument without contradicting yourself. I'm sure you wouldn't have a clue, because you have never been around a gun, never been trained to clean, carry, fire or store a gun; therefore, you are ignorant about guns and afraid of anyone who actually knows what they are doing when it comes to rightfully possessing one. In addition, to infer that everyone who carries a gun has some sort of inferiority, "I'm so cool" or "macho" complex expounds upon your ignorance. My mother carries a concealed weapon in her purse, is she macho and trying to show off (BTW she is 67 years old)? I'm sure you have no problem with individuals using and possessing marijuana in a park in front of your family and children with their "medicinal marijuana" card. Yeah, they aren't exhibiting any "I'm so cool" complex whatsoever. Remember, every single time you go to a mall, there is someone there illegally possessing a gun!

natelw said on November 15, 2009 at 9:24 AM

In addition, to all of those who say, "I don't want some guy carrying their gun at a park or community center when my family is around!" I have news for you, there is definitively, absolutely, positively, already someone carrying a gun, illegally, every time you step foot into a place like that. Next time you go to the Seattle center for a festival, know this to be true, there are thugs there carrying illegal firearms, it is a fact!

natelw said on November 15, 2009 at 8:55 AM

BTW, it is Concealed Pistol License (CPL) in Washington State, not CWP. Just thought I would add that to the conversation.

world_citizen said on November 15, 2009 at 8:54 AM

Carrying a gun in public places in front of kids and members of the community is no different than saying "Kids, I am such a coward, I am always afraid and need protection from this gun" or "look Mr. criminal, let me show you how easy it is to buy a gun and show it in public, in fact I will protect your right to carry guns" or "I am so cool, I own a gun or two or many more!". In fact, there is very little difference between the so-called legal gun owners who want to act "Macho" in public and the criminals who use the SAME type of guns to commit a crime. Lead by example and suffer the consequences. Sadly, innocent people will suffer the consequences also and chances are the innocent ones are victims in their own home. Wake up people, guns kill and you make it easy for the dead industry to continue to grow. I don't need and don't want a gun because I believe the Law is pervasive and very wrong!

natelw said on November 15, 2009 at 8:49 AM

I can't believe all the crazies out there who honestly believe that those in legal possession of a gun will somehow just miraculously snap! These folks, uninformed & close-minded, are more than willing to pontificate on a subject about which they have no education. It is the criminals, illegally possessing weapons, who realize that their targets most likely won't be armed. It is amazing the City will allow illegal drug use in front of families and children at a "folk life" (i.e. pot smoking, heroin shooting, cocaine using) festival, but will deny good people the right to legally protect themselves. What is sad is when the City of Seattle definitively takes away the right to legally possess a concealed gun at a park, it assumes responsibility for the protection of everyone at that park and anyone who has a license to legally carry would have standing to sue the City if they were the victim of a crime on the park, this is why the mayor is a fool!

deniseh1006 said on November 15, 2009 at 8:05 AM

maimeogram: The real morons are the ones that think reasoning with a criminal high on drugs with an itchy trigger finger is a good idea. Someone with a concealed weapons permit is less likely to blow someone's head off. I bet you would be singing a different tune if you or a family member was in a situation where someone with a CWP saved your life.

tracer2009 said on November 15, 2009 at 7:51 AM

Unless your name's Quick Draw McGraw, there's no way in hell carrying a concealed weapon is going to protect all you Charlton-Heston wannabees. If someone goes postal in a community center (God forbid) and takes you out, how is your Glock going help you then? Carrying a weapon does nothing more than aid a moron feel more like a man. The mayor won't be missed but he was right-on here.

browndog said on November 15, 2009 at 7:46 AM

If I have a gun on me you will never know. That is why it is called a concealed weapon permit. I know where the law allows me to carry my weapon. It has nothing to do with being a man but everything to do with my rights and the protection of me and my family. The bad guys will carry their weapons anywhere at anytime no matter what law is created. There is a reason Mayor Nickels did not win the last election.

jbullat said on November 15, 2009 at 6:54 AM

andso said on November 14, 2009 at 7:46 PM I'm sorry..how can you be charged with trespassing on public property??. Of course, because,you see, when liberals are in charge they own it. Just like your money for instance. A great illustration was during the Clinton inauguration when they had the military fly over and one hollywood liberal said to her friend, "Oh why do they have to do that here?" and her friend said, "Oh, it's OK, They are our jets now." How's that "Change workin out there?

jbullat said on November 15, 2009 at 6:45 AM

Hey Kalaloch, walk the talk. Put a huge sign in your yard advertising that your residence is GUN FREE! Then leave the kids home with the teenage babysitter. CWP owners care more about your kids than you do.

dennilane said on November 15, 2009 at 1:06 AM

I'm amazed at how many people get confused by the people who carry guns *legally* and follow all the laws and guidelines of gun ownership, to obtain a permit issued by the sheriff, (who does a background check, including taking fingerprints) who only want to protect themselves from the crazy people who want to carry guns illegally and shoot other people dead with their guns. FYI, People who take gun ownership and conceal weapons legally do not say Gomer phrases like 'Packing Heat'. Dork.

maimeogram said on November 14, 2009 at 11:47 PM

Oh, brother, you morons... yet when someone "packing heat" like Mr. Warden walks into a public building and starts taking people out one by one, you'll be the first ones to blame someone else for the tragedy. What a bunch of idiots.

maimeogram said on November 14, 2009 at 11:44 PM

Wah, wah, wah... pooh, pooh wuttle baby can't have his wuttle bang, bang boom... :-(

ritamae said on November 14, 2009 at 11:24 PM

"Civil Rights"? With civil rights go public responsibility. This individual has serious identity issues if he feels the need to carry a weapon to go out in public. There are adult issues in our country that require more attention than packing heat.

cibicsi said on November 14, 2009 at 9:44 PM

Well done Bob. As a gun owner and a CWP holder I have much respect for your actions. You had a loud voice, which represented many of us today. Remember if you outlaw guns only outlaws will have guns.

bookintyme said on November 14, 2009 at 9:10 PM

Thank you, Mr. Warden. You have taken the nest legal step standing up for all of us and for the 2nd Ammendment.

concealedcarrier said on November 14, 2009 at 8:40 PM

The ban is illegal and a waste of tax payer money. He did this as a last ditch effort to gain popularity amongst other anti gun politicians when he runs for his next office. The people who are for this ban will be singing a different tune when they get mugged and are sitting on the phone talking to 911 while the crook gets away with their property. It AMAZES me how people think that a gun ban let alone an illegal one will have any influence over criminals. They are called criminals because they don't obey laws. So this gun ban that some of you are in favor of prevents people like me (who have a CPL and legally carry a firearm) from being able to protect not only myself but YOU and your children from CRIMINAL attack. So continue thinking that because you are in a location with no guns allowed that you are safe. Also keep in mind that at Columbine, Virginia Tech and the immigration center in New York there were "No Firearms" policies in place.

jimaguenther said on November 14, 2009 at 8:17 PM

I carry concealed everywhere, all the time. The reason I carry concealed instead of openly is because I want to choose the time and place when to defend the right of self defense and I know that a lot of people have been trained to be afraid of weapons and I prefer no to scare them. What is so hard to understand about the second amendment? "The right of the people to keep and bear arms shall NOT be infringed."? The police are not required to defend the citizens. You cannot sue law enforcement for not defending you or your loved ones. I would rather take my chances on my own abilities to defend myself and my loved ones than to call 911 and wait for law enforcement to possibly show up and do their job. I aaplaud Bob's principaled action to defend all our rights. If we the people do not stand up and defend our Constitution and Bill of Rights how can we expect them to defend us? You who fear guns like "kalaloch" should know that I will willingly risk my life to defend yours!

dogidoright said on November 14, 2009 at 7:59 PM

I praise Mr Warden for his actions today. It is the beginning of a challenge to the Seattle and Washington State Politicians that they cannot skirt the existing rule of law by creating their own rules through politcal agenda. This ban had nothing to do with protecting anybody; it is an attempt to deprive law abiding American Citizens their rights. I hope that the folks praising Mr Warden for his actions remeber that this is just the beginning of a much larger battle to come with the Federal Government in attempting to stomp on our rights such as the attempt to disarm us through the so-called Health -Care Bill. For all of you I suggest you become active if you haven't already; join the NRA, Gun Owners of America, or the Citizens Committee For the Right to Keep and Bear Arms. Protect our right to defense.

andso said on November 14, 2009 at 7:46 PM

I'm sorry..how can you be charged with trespassing on public property??

factoid said on November 14, 2009 at 7:24 PM

Kind of a divisive comment 'memyselfandi'. I though liberals where all about inclusion. Oh wait, that is only when you get your way.

deniseh1006 said on November 14, 2009 at 7:12 PM

Nickles ruling will most likely be overturned once he is out of office. He is just trying to cause problems before leaving. His departure is long over-due. I am considering getting a concealed weapon permit. You never know when you will need it, and at least with concealed wepon permits there is a background check so you have less to worry about with someone who is legally able to carry a gun than with the criminals.

memyselfandi said on November 14, 2009 at 6:39 PM

A Kent man protesting a Seattle ordinance. Stay in Kent with your gun, tool.

puyalluprox said on November 14, 2009 at 6:13 PM

Seattle will be paying for Nickels' incompetence long after he is out of office...

factoid said on November 14, 2009 at 5:41 PM

"kalaloch" I suppose when a criminal enters the center with a gun and threatens you and your child, you would wish Mr. Warden was there. I wonder why Mr. Nickel's made an executive order that he knows is unconstitutional. Is anyone else bothered by this blatant waste of our tax money?

92cg6 said on November 14, 2009 at 5:35 PM

Has nothing to do with an inferiority complex, unfortunately its just the world we live in today. If I happen to be out in public enjoying a day with my family, and was forced into a dangerous situation where seconds could mean the difference between life or death.. I'd much rather have a loaded gun in my hand instead of a cell phone talking to a 911 dispatcher.

kalaloch said on November 14, 2009 at 5:04 PM

If he needs a weapon to feel like a man, OK. However, when I take my kids to a Community Center, I don't want someone with an inferiority complex anywhere someone with a loaded weapon. Leave it outside, buddy.

spiritus said on November 14, 2009 at 4:48 PM

Well done Mr. Warden! We who could not be there with you support your efforts on behalf of all law-abiding gun owners!